Learning Spanish

[fiberisgoodforyou]

It is official, as I am to understand it, that all students attending Boro Public Schools, K-5 will be forcedrequired to learn Spanish....

Excuse Reason given as this is a state mandate.

[bergsteiger]

I’m so glad my son is out of public schools. Currently, in Med School. I worry about my nieces and nephews, which are being indoctrinated in the cult of multiculturalism. I have to work real hard to undue all the brain washing they are being subjected too.

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Why early language education? The big picture:

* Prepare your child to work and succeed in the increasing global environment.

* Enhance your child's appreciation of his/her own language and culture.

* Ensure better academic performance and higher test scores (The College Board SAT, 2003).

* Enable your child to attain native fluency and pronunciation. Learning a Language before adolescence ensures native level pronunciation (Strotzer, J.R, 1994).

* Develop your child's self confidence.

* Expose your child to different ways of thinking and awaken an interest in other cultures

In my profession, I engage with colleges and clients from around the world, Germany, Korea, France, China, Israel, Russia, India, Japan etc...

EVERY one of my global economic partners speak English!

For children to learn Spanish because, Spanish alone will "Prepare your child to work and succeed in the increasing global environment" is Crap seriously inaccurate!

This Enhance your child's appreciation of his/her own language and culture is plain silliness. Until a child has full awareness of American Culture and language, immersion into other culture dilutes their self esteem of their native culture!

To confuse a child with adult expressions of Culture vs. Family Heritage. Lets focus on American Culture first, and exchange of our families heritage concurrently!

But I am just a poor uneducated, lowly mortal parent, not an overly learned Master Degreed-ed Professional Education Administrator!

While Other global economic power-houses prepare their children with Math, Computer Skills and Science from an early age, so when our children (our future) need to compete in a global economy our kids know Spanish from an early age!

This is why so much technology is out sourced to Asia, not just because the labor is cheaper, but because that are education priorities are focused better. This is why Asian economies are rapidly expanding, same for Europe. They value Native language skills and focus on MATH AND SCIENCE.

If we are an immigrant nation, it is because people come here for the opportunities our American culture will yield.

[Casual Reader]

Figgy Dude:

Your arguments about learning (or not learning) Spanish make no sense at all.

It is a wonderful thing to learn one -- two -- three langauges. I am in the process of taking Spanish classes and I love it.

If all your clients can learn English then certainly you and your children can learn other languages. Your arrogance about English is exactly what foreigners hate about Americans.

Are you too good to learn another language? Everyone needs to learn your language to function in the global marketplace?

I think all children should be required to learn two or three other languages. I wish I had when I was younger.


Casually a Global Citizen

[fiberisgoodforyou]

bergsteiger said:

I’m so glad my son is out of public schools. Currently, in Med School. I worry about my nieces and nephews, which are being indoctrinated in the cult of multiculturalism. I have to work real hard to undue all the brain washing they are being subjected too.

"indoctrinated in the cult of multiculturalism"

I was shocked and had cold shivers up my spine last May watching multicultural multimedia essay contest winners at a School Board meeting.

The subject matter was how your grandparents came to the USA. One girl referenced her grandparents life in a small Mexican village, and came here as illegal immigrants. Another child referenced how her grand parents managed to survive the Holocaust, lived in a concentration camp and came to the USA as refuges!

I wanted to hit the teacher across the back of her head for allowing these to "immigrant stories" to be on par with each other!

This was my recolection, if someone else who had been there reads this post, please tell me I was all wrong about my observation!

[bergsteiger]

My son is over the hump and will do very well for himself when he finally becomes a doctor. He took French, German, and Latin. Latin, he feels did him the most good because of all the science classes. One time an illegal alien blew leaves all over his truck and he wanted to yell at him but he didn’t know Spanish. That was the one time he said he wished he knew some basic Spanish.

He is in his first year of Medical School on a full Scholarship and a Captain in the Air Force; I wonder how far he would have been by now if he spoke Spanish.

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Casual said:

Figgy Dude:

Your arguments about learning (or not learning) Spanish make no sense at all.

It is a wonderful thing to learn one -- two -- three languages. I am in the process of taking Spanish classes and I love it.

If all your clients can learn English then certainly you and your children can learn other languages. Your arrogance about English is exactly what foreigners hate about Americans.

Are you too good to learn another language? Everyone needs to learn your language to function in the global marketplace?

I think all children should be required to learn two or three other languages. I wish I had when I was younger.


Casually a Global Citizen

WOW GREAT INPUT THANKS FOR YOUR REPLY!
Your insight is refreshing and intelligent!
Have a grrrrreat day!

[Freehold Resident]

America has a problem with self-induced stupidity. It's almost as if we would rather NOT be smarter than average.

Now I understand the reasoning, for the most part, why you don't want them to be required to learn Spanish. The whole, "why should we pay our tax money to teach Spanish--our country is being overrun by people from south of the border," but at the same time, if you go to any country in Europe or most of the world, they not only know one language, or even two, but they know a few of them.

Here in America we don't want to learn anything or know anything other than our own homogenous culture. We say that we are full of multiculturalism, but that's a fallacy. What we are is a country full of different cultures who are all forced into the box of one culture. The fact that we are a melting pot, or quilt, or salad bowl is one of the biggest lies ever told. It's a joke.

FR

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Casual said:

Figgy Dude:

Your arguments about learning (or not learning) Spanish make no sense at all.

It is a wonderful thing to learn one -- two -- three languages. I am in the process of taking Spanish classes and I love it.

If all your clients can learn English then certainly you and your children can learn other languages. Your arrogance about English is exactly what foreigners hate about Americans.

Are you too good to learn another language? Everyone needs to learn your language to function in the global marketplace?

I think all children should be required to learn two or three other languages. I wish I had when I was younger.


Casually a Global Citizen

My High School Spanish came in handy when I travel the Yucatan. I was able to Honda with the natives when I bought a statue of Quexiquoto, AND Akhushtal from roadside hawkers. Not my vision of a global economy, sorry.

More to the point, Spanish is not a critical language for the global economy. There are other more appropriate linguistically nessasary skills that are more predominant keys to sucsess in a global economy.

Again, thank you for your input! Your a valuable poster here.

[Casual Reader]

Figgy Dude:

Your arrogance is appalling. Why shouldn't the Jewish story of immigration be told alongside the Mexican story? What are you a censor? What would you have told one child that her story was not fit to be told?

The point of the essay was "How you got here" -- so people arrived different ways. Who are you to devalue the experience of other children just because you think one story had more meaning for you?

One has a more tragic aspect than another -- They are different stories -- both are part of out history. They both need to be told.

Casually Disagreeing

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Freehold said:

America has a problem with self-induced stupidity. It's almost as if we would rather NOT be smarter than average.

Now I understand the reasoning, for the most part, why you don't want them to be required to learn Spanish. The whole, "why should we pay our tax money to teach Spanish--our country is being overrun by people from south of the border," but at the same time, if you go to any country in Europe or most of the world, they not only know one language, or even two, but they know a few of them.

Here in America we don't want to learn anything or know anything other than our own homogenous culture. We say that we are full of multiculturalism, but that's a fallacy. What we are is a country full of different cultures who are all forced into the box of one culture. The fact that we are a melting pot, or quilt, or salad bowl is one of the biggest lies ever told. It's a joke.

FR

ahhhhhhhhhh. whats your point? Am I missing somthing?

My point is simply this, why spanish and why does a parent not get a choice in languages? We are not a latin american country last time I checked!

BTW, there is an AMERICAN Culture!

The Culture of the United States is a Western culture, and has been developing since long before the United States became a country. Today the United States is a diverse and multi-cultural nation.[1]

Its chief early influence was British culture, due to colonial ties with the British that spread the English language, legal system and other cultural inheritances. Other important influences came from other parts of Europe, especially countries from which large numbers immigrated such as Ireland, Germany, Poland, and Italy; the Native American peoples; Africa, especially the western part, from which came the ancestors of most African Americans; and young groups of immigrants. American culture also has shared influence on the cultures of its neighbors in the New World.

The United States has traditionally been known as a melting pot, but recent left leaning academics tend towards cultural diversity, pluralism and the image of a salad bowl rather than a melting pot.[2][3] Due to the extent of American culture there are many integrated but unique subcultures within the United States. The cultural affiliations an individual in the United States may have commonly depend on social class, political orientation and a multitude of demographic characteristics such as ancestral traditions, sex and sexual orientation.[1] The strongest influences on American culture came from northern European cultures, most prominently from Germany, Ireland and England.[3] There are great regional and subcultural differences, making American culture mostly heterogeneous ( go pick on Wiki not me, their choice of words, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_of_the_United_States )

[Casual Reader]

Figgy Dude:

I think a variety of languages would be great. Spanish seems like an important one for the future -- given its growing use in the US.

Obviously, many companies do not agree with you about Spanish's lack of importance.

Often when you call a company they ask you whether you want to hear the information in English or Spanish. They know it will bother people like you -- still they do it -- because they want the dollars. Money is their language.

If you want to sell to a community you need to be able to communicate with it.

You are a wonderful contributor as well and I value you your opinions.

Casually a Capitalist

[bergsteiger]

fiberisgoodforyou said:

bergsteiger said:

I’m so glad my son is out of public schools. Currently, in Med School. I worry about my nieces and nephews, which are being indoctrinated in the cult of multiculturalism. I have to work real hard to undue all the brain washing they are being subjected too.

"indoctrinated in the cult of multiculturalism"

I was shocked and had cold shivers up my spine last May watching multicultural multimedia essay contest winners at a School Board meeting.

The subject matter was how your grandparents came to the USA. One girl referenced her grandparents life in a small Mexican village, and came here as illegal immigrants. Another child referenced how her grand parents managed to survive the Holocaust, lived in a concentration camp and came to the USA as refuges!

I wanted to hit the teacher across the back of her head for allowing these to "immigrant stories" to be on par with each other!

This was my recolection, if someone else who had been there reads this post, please tell me I was all wrong about my observation!

I kind of wish I was in school now to tell the story of my ancestors.

I would start out by saying my grandparents were American, they worked really hard at manual labor jobs to build up this country to what it is today. They wanted to make a better life for themselves and their offspring, not the offspring of radically different third world nations. When faced with aggression from foreign nations my grandfathers volunteered to go to war and fight for this countries freedom. They knew only one language and that language was English. Right now they are probably rolling over in their graves.

[Freehold Resident]

Most of America's culture comes from OTHER cultures. There is not really a distinct American culture, as there are in other countries around the world.

>The strongest influences on American culture came from northern European cultures, most prominently from Germany, Ireland and England.

Exactly my point. White White White. Mostly WASP.

And you're right...we do have a lot of different "cultures" here, but as soon as they come here, they are told that they need to identify/align with "American culture" or they are not accepted. Now with illegal immigrants, it's a whole different story, because they came here illegally and therefore should not be here in the first place, let alone waving their flags, etc. However, anyone other than straight, white, christian men are seen as having to change their ways. Black people are made to act white. Gay men should act macho or straight/ gay women should act femme or straight. Hispanic people should act white. Asians are seen as a threat because they are smarter, so they are basically treated as if they should be dumbed down. We don't like the French. Chinese people are told to speak better English and basically just treated as if they only should be here to make Chinese food for us. And so on. And when you get down to the end, all everyone really wants is for all of these different minorities and ethnicities to act like White, Straight, Anglo Men.

FR

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Casual said:

Figgy Dude:

Your arrogance is appalling. Why shouldn't the Jewish story of immigration be told alongside the Mexican story? What are you a censor? What would you have told one child that her story was not fit to be told?

The point of the essay was "How you got here" -- so people arrived different ways. Who are you to devalue the experience of other children just because you think one story had more meaning for you?

One has a more tragic aspect than another -- They are different stories -- both are part of out history. They both need to be told.

Casually Disagreeing

Thank you again!

There is a very big differance between being a refugee escaping a gas chamber and an oven vs. illegaly seeking an hourly wage!

How do you spell S*M*U*C*K?
C*a*s*u*a*l - R*e*a*d*e*r

[Casual Reader]

Figster:

The question is one of censorship and preference.

The story about the Jews fleeing a concentration camp rightly resonated with you. It was more heroic -- more dramatic ( I was not there).

But it is not the only story -- The Mexicans have their own immigration story. That story can and should be told. We don't need someone telling us which stories can be told and which cannot be told.

Casually Ignoring your hurtful words

[bergsteiger]

Freehold said:

Most of America's culture comes from OTHER cultures. There is not really a distinct American culture, as there are in other countries around the world.

>The strongest influences on American culture came from northern European cultures, most prominently from Germany, Ireland and England.

Exactly my point. White White White. Mostly WASP.

And you're right...we do have a lot of different "cultures" here, but as soon as they come here, they are told that they need to identify/align with "American culture" or they are not accepted. Now with illegal immigrants, it's a whole different story, because they came here illegally and therefore should not be here in the first place, let alone waving their flags, etc. However, anyone other than straight, white, christian men are seen as having to change their ways. Black people are made to act white. Gay men should act macho or straight/ gay women should act femme or straight. Hispanic people should act white. Asians are seen as a threat because they are smarter, so they are basically treated as if they should be dumbed down. We don't like the French. Chinese people are told to speak better English and basically just treated as if they only should be here to make Chinese food for us. And so on. And when you get down to the end, all everyone really wants is for all of these different minorities and ethnicities to act like White, Straight, Anglo Men.

FR

FR,

You come off very angry most of the time. I think you need a new PR guy. I think you should hire misterpr. On second thought forget that, he seems to have the same anger issues that you have.

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Casual said:

Figster:

The question is one of censorship and preference.

The story about the Jews fleeing a concentration camp rightly resonated with you. It was more heroic -- more dramatic ( I was not there).

But it is not the only story -- The Mexicans have their own immigration story. That story can and should be told. We don't need someone telling us which stories can be told and which cannot be told.

Casually Ignoring your hurtful words

And I will assertively reiterate... C*a*s*u*a*l - R*e*a*d*e*r

Any further replies to any of your posts equates to an atempt to reason with a drunk in a bar, why bother!

[fiberisgoodforyou]

bergsteiger said:

Freehold said:

FR

FR,

You come off very angry most of the time. I think you need a new PR guy. I think you should hire misterpr. On second thought forget that, he seems to have the same anger issues that you have.

ENOUGH PLEASE...I may have posted this before, I will again...

As my father told me, If you have nothing nice to say, Keep it to yourself!

[fiberisgoodforyou]

Freehold said:

Exactly my point. White White White. Mostly WASP.
FR

You enjoy Music? Modern music is totaly influanced by AMERICAN Culture, and Black American Culture is most influental on AMERICAN Music!

Rag Time, Blues, Jazz, Rock and Roll, Soul. Same for Latin Music, heavily influanced by Afro rythms, melodies and beat!

Part of our Melting pot that the WORLD has adopted!
American Culture Is
The Andrew and Sister Sledge, Baseball and Basket Ball, Rhapsody in Blue and Blue Bayou, Armstrong, Aldrin and Alvin Ailey, Norman Rockwell, Georgia O'Keeffe, George Eastman, Dr. Land, The Motion Picture Industry, Ford, Bell and Edison, The American Revolution, Franklyn and Jefferson, US Grant and Jefferson Davis, The Bill of Rights, KFC and Broadcast TV, William Billings, John Philip Susa, Eubie Blake, Elvis, Chuck Berry and Bill Haley, Dorothy and Toto too, Hemingway and Poe, Jimmy Hendrix, John Williams and Aaron Copland, Haight-Ashbury, New Orleans and Minnitonka Mn, Tuna Hot Dish and Ambrosia Salad, Bully, We like Ike, and the Buck Stops Here!, ChinaTown and Downtown (ever hear of Down Down Paris?), Stetson, Smith and Wesson, Mustangs and Muscle cars, d**n the torpedoes!, American Art Deco, Washington Irving, GW Carver Peanut Butter and the traffic light, MLK, Poor Richard's Almanack, Iron Clades, Peter Copper, Robert Fulton, Colin Powell, Erie Canal, Woodstock and Ronald Raygunz...... I have to stop for now... ;D

[Zeus]

Most Widely Spoken Languages in the World
Language Approx. number of speakers

1. Chinese (Mandarin) 1,075,000,000
2. English 514,000,000
3. Hindustani1 496,000,000
4. Spanish 425,000,000
5. Russian 275,000,000
6. Arabic 256,000,000
7. Bengali 215,000,000
8. Portuguese 194,000,000
9. Malay-Indonesian 176,000,000
10. French 129,000,000

_____________________________________
Most Studied Foreign Languages in the U.S.
Language Fall 2002 enrollments % change from 1998

1. Spanish 746,267 13.7% 2. French 201,979 1.5 3. German 91,100 2.3 4. Italian 63,899 29.6 5. American Sign Language 60,781 432.22 6. Japanese 52,238 21.1 7. Chinese 34,153 20.0 8. Latin 29,841 14.1 9. Russian 23,921 0.5 10. Ancient Greek3 20,376 24.2

www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0775272.html

[Freehold Resident]

New PR guy? Why would I need a PR guy?

Once again Turdsteiger's comments make absolutely. no. sense. What a surprise.

FR

[bergsteiger]

Zeus said:

Most Widely Spoken Languages in the World
Language Approx. number of speakers

1. Chinese (Mandarin) 1,075,000,000
2. English 514,000,000
3. Hindustani1 496,000,000
4. Spanish 425,000,000
5. Russian 275,000,000
6. Arabic 256,000,000
7. Bengali 215,000,000
8. Portuguese 194,000,000
9. Malay-Indonesian 176,000,000
10. French 129,000,000

_____________________________________
Most Studied Foreign Languages in the U.S.
Language Fall 2002 enrollments % change from 1998

1. Spanish 746,267 13.7% 2. French 201,979 1.5 3. German 91,100 2.3 4. Italian 63,899 29.6 5. American Sign Language 60,781 432.22 6. Japanese 52,238 21.1 7. Chinese 34,153 20.0 8. Latin 29,841 14.1 9. Russian 23,921 0.5 10. Ancient Greek3 20,376 24.2

www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0775272.html

Where is the data for the language and percent spoken in this country?

What do you think the percent of voluntarily studied language is?

[Casual Reader]

What is really sad figman is how you despise the children of immigrants and their experiences. Sad because they are the classmates of your children.

It must be difficult to live inside such a small mind.

Casually Sad

[Freehold Resident]

Oh, by the way. That is a typical Republican tactic in debating:

When Repubs disagree with what someone else says, instead of giving facts or opinions to back it up, they just lower yourself to insulting or name-calling or witch-hunting.

Whereas, I may be angry when I post, but I still back it up to prove my point.

FR

[Zeus]

factfinder.census.gov/servlet/QTTable?_bm=y&-geo_id=D&-qr_name=DEC_2000_SF3_U_QTP16&-ds_name=D&-_lang=en

bergsteiger said:

Zeus said:

Most Widely Spoken Languages in the World
Language Approx. number of speakers

1. Chinese (Mandarin) 1,075,000,000
2. English 514,000,000
3. Hindustani1 496,000,000
4. Spanish 425,000,000
5. Russian 275,000,000
6. Arabic 256,000,000
7. Bengali 215,000,000
8. Portuguese 194,000,000
9. Malay-Indonesian 176,000,000
10. French 129,000,000

_____________________________________
Most Studied Foreign Languages in the U.S.
Language Fall 2002 enrollments % change from 1998

1. Spanish 746,267 13.7% 2. French 201,979 1.5 3. German 91,100 2.3 4. Italian 63,899 29.6 5. American Sign Language 60,781 432.22 6. Japanese 52,238 21.1 7. Chinese 34,153 20.0 8. Latin 29,841 14.1 9. Russian 23,921 0.5 10. Ancient Greek3 20,376 24.2

www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0775272.html

Where is the data for the language and percent spoken in this country?

What do you think the percent of voluntarily studied language is?

[bergsteiger]

Freehold said:

Oh, by the way. That is a typical Republican tactic in debating:

When Repubs disagree with what someone else says, instead of giving facts or opinions to back it up, they just lower yourself to insulting or name-calling or witch-hunting.

Whereas, I may be angry when I post, but I still back it up to prove my point.

FR[/quote


You don’t when to quit do you? I suggest you drop it besides your getting off topic.

[Freehold Resident]

It's "you're," not "your."

Hmm..maybe Fiber is right. Maybe we shouldn't learn a second language. Some of us don't even know how to speak our primary language!

FR

[bergsteiger]

calliope said:

I for one love and appreciate all languages; I find communication endlessly fascinating.

I love to listen to a different language being spoken, to see if I can discern certain sounds. I love the musical structure, the cadence of languages. I often wonder about original derivation of particular languages, even regional dialects.

Watching anybody speaking his or her native language is interesting because in general, facial expressions and body language are the things that can be interpreted correctly by almost anyone.

The one thing I cannot stand, however, is the overuse and abuse of the word "like" in typical young-person speak. The way to quell this is to hook these kids up to an electric zapper that volts them every time that word is spoken. That should learn 'em good.

The electric zapper is torture. We should save that for terrorist and criminals. All we need to do is have them spend more time in English class till they get it right.

Where will the time come from you ask?

How about using the time they spend learning to forget Spanish.

[Freehold Resident]

I think YOU need to spend more time in English class before telling anyone else that they should.

FR