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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 12, 2007 10:26:55 GMT -5
Great news, the HR committee is not going to die an early death. Rather they are entertaining many ideas from teh hispanic community. Most of which focus on getting free public services. From the comments in this article, it seems that council member Sims was very receptive to spending your tax dollars. Human relations panel expects to continue work BY CLARE MARIE CELANO Staff Writer FREEHOLD - The Freehold Borough Human Relations Committee has been told that the Borough Council wants it to continue its mission. At last week's meeting of the committee, Councilman Jaye Sims said the panel will continue to exist and asked the members who were present if they would be interested in staying on in 2008. Committee members the Rev. Frederick Parrish, Sheryl Mott, Carol Lida and James Keelan said they would like to return to the panel in 2008. Freehold Borough Patrolman Ronnie Steppat, who represents the police department, said he would also like to remain on the committee, but said that decision is up to Police Chief Mitchell Roth. Parrish, who chairs the committee, recently spoke to the mayor and council about several difficulties the panel was encountering. Among those concerns were comments being made about committee members on an Internet message board. Sims said Mayor Michael Wilson and the council were discussing the addition of new members to the committee and would be ready to make appointments in early January. In other business, committee members reviewed suggestions that were received when the panel staffed a booth at the borough's Latino Festival in October. There were about 40 suggestion forms filled out from among hundreds of people who attended the event. According to the committee, about 30 of the suggestion forms were written in Spanish and were translated by committee member Juan Reyes. In broad terms, the suggestion sheets referred to issues including public transportation in Freehold (or a lack thereof), day care for children, medical coverage and classes that teach English. Other comments referenced general problems with the interaction between some members of the borough's Latino community and the police department. Parrish asked Sims to address the comments on behalf of the council. In noting that some suggestions made reference to a desire for full-day children's care, Sims said the Head Start program is federally funded and that due to cuts in funding there is not much of a chance the half-day program will expand to a full-day program anytime soon. Other suggestions received by the committee included requests for better medical coverage for children and more communication and information as to charity cases. Still other suggestions referenced t he lack of bus transportation to Freehold Borough elementary schools (the school district does not provide busing), and the lack of public transportation to local supermarkets and to CentraState Medical Center in Freehold Township. Mott said public transportation is available in the borough and that buses go past the supermarkets and to the hospital. In regard to additional English classes, Sims said he was meeting with officials from Hightstown, which also has a large Latino population, to discuss how they address the need for English classes for adult residents. Keelan, who is the president of the Freehold Borough Board of Education, noted that the school district currently provides English and Spanish classes for adults in the evening. Sims asked about weekend classes. Keelan said weekend classes are not offered, but suggested that Sims contact school district administrators to discuss that possibility. As to the claims of incidents that allegedly involved police officers, Parrish said the committee members were not in a position to address those issues since they had no information as to any specific complaints. He said there are two sides to a story and said he would need to hear both sides in this type of incident. Parrish asked Steppat to address these issues with Roth. "We need to get with the police department and find out how we can improve the situation and not make it worse," Parrish said. The purpose of the Human Relations Committee is to foster good relations among all the residents of the borough; to discuss and attempt to resolve the different circumstances brought before the committee and present them to the council; to set different goals or seminars, inform residents of changes, safety concerns, health concerns, and any other concerns that members deem necessary to present; and to seek any and all information from city, county and state agencies that might help the committee to function in an encouraging and productive manner. newstranscript.gmnews.com/news/2007/1212/Front_Page/028.html |
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Post by admin on Dec 12, 2007 14:54:10 GMT -5
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Post by casualreader on Dec 14, 2007 9:23:22 GMT -5
Freehold Borough Community:
I am not the best person to defend the Hispanic community but until there is greater integration/diversity on this message board I will proudly serve that role.
The last few days have seen a rash of attacks against the Hispanic community and we are gradually slipping into ethnic bashing, again. Now the smartest of you always say "I love Hispanics" (like DeFonzo dude) but "I hate illegal immigration and what it is doing to my beloved town."
But, using the Kelso dude's legalese let me use the title of this post as "Exhibit A." -- Libyan Sybil -- decides to call it "Hispanics request more free stuff."
I read the article and to say that characterization is "muy malo" is to put it mildly.
According to the article one of the things they are asking about is English language courses.
This is a classic example of attacking this community no matter what they do. People like LS would criticize them if they don't learn English -- but if they inquire about English language classes they are looking for handouts.
In the small world where LS lives this group just can't win.
They raise questions about public transportation -- well of course they do -- it stinks. Is this an unfair question for them to inquire about.
I have had to take busses from downtown and the surrounding areas and the service is irregular. It can take several hours to get to the shore communities depending on the bus schedule.
As for day care, for all the couples with children that I know this is a major issue. Nowhere in the article does it say they want free child care.
I just finished reading an article in one of my psychology journals on corporate worker satisfaction and it says that the following are the three most important issues for workers today -- 1. Health Benefits 2. Child Care/Day Care 3. Salary.
It turns out many American workers want child care included by their employers as part of a benefits package -- either at the place of employment or nearby.
Final Point -- Your characterizations of the Hispanic community are unfair and reflect prejudices that you hold against it.
Casually Debating the Issues
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 14, 2007 9:44:12 GMT -5
CR,
You miss the point (again). I want the illegals to learn english. As long as they are here, I want all immigrants (legal and illegal) to be productive, but without being a drain on the rest of society. I am against public spending to accomodate people illegally here.
I think if you bothered to go back to assess all of my posts (there are many so I don't really expect you to), I think you will see that as a general rule, I am against higher taxes and bigger government. I am against many additional services. I am for people doing things on their own.
I am for the individual. I think the biggest problem with the hispanic community in town is the lack of leadership. (I sincerely hope that Mr. Reyes, or someone else will provide that). Someone needs to organize this group - not as a voting or a political block, but as a group that will take care of its own - that will fund a hispanic center, that will provide those desired and needed services to its own community, that will foster integration with the rest of American society. Don't expect me to pay for your ESL classes, or to pay for your babysitters.
What we don't need are people coming here illegally, demanding the right to work, the right to loiter, the right for free services, demanding free medical benefits, demanding public transportation services, demanding educational programs for grown adults, demanding that a free public services be provided so they can figure out how to get more free public services, etc. Rightly or wrongly (and I say rightly), the illegal immigrants are accused on draining tax money and services. Well, there they go again.
So, as to your big 3 - 1. Health Benefits 2. Child Care/Day Care 3. Salary. Get it yourself. Pay for it yourself. Get a job. Don't bother me.
Jaye Sims seems like a nice guy, but I hope when he goes back to council, he does not push for spending more taxpayer money.
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Post by casualreader on Dec 14, 2007 10:16:50 GMT -5
LS -- This issue about paying for services is a broad one which goes well beyond the Hispanic community. I understand your points quite well because I have never seen you write a positive word about the Hispanic community. Its getting close to Christmas -- Give it a try you old Scrooge.  My point is that their inquiries (Hispanic community) about public transporation, day care and ESL classes are perfectly legitimate. Nowhere in the article does it say they want free services. When I get on a bus -- I pay a fare. That is not stealing from the system. Public transportation gets people where they need to go. They pay for that service -- That is true of Hispanics or anyone else. -- This is not "free stuff." Who says the ESL classes have to be free? Who says day care services should not be paid for? The article does not deal with that -- You brought those assumptions into your analysis because of your biased views of the community. The questions they raised in their notes to the HRC are legitimate for anyone to ask. Casually Declining Handouts |
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bergsteiger
Full Member
War is simple, direct, and ruthless
Posts: 1,189
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Post by bergsteiger on Dec 14, 2007 11:23:05 GMT -5
The Hispanic community could have anything they are capable of paying for just like everyone else. CR must be casually hallucinating because that article is all about getting free stuff, not for the poor but for Hispanics.
Casually Clutching my Wallet
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adefonzo
Junior Member
If I can see further than some, it's because I have stood on the shoulders of giants
Posts: 308
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Post by adefonzo on Dec 14, 2007 12:00:38 GMT -5
LS -- This issue about paying for services is a broad one which goes well beyond the Hispanic community. I understand your points quite well because I have never seen you write a positive word about the Hispanic community. Its getting close to Christmas -- Give it a try you old Scrooge. My point is that their inquiries (Hispanic community) about public transporation, day care and ESL classes are perfectly legitimate. Nowhere in the article does it say they want free services. When I get on a bus -- I pay a fare. That is not stealing from the system. Public transportation gets people where they need to go. They pay for that service -- That is true of Hispanics or anyone else. -- This is not "free stuff." Who says the ESL classes have to be free? Who says day care services should not be paid for? The article does not deal with that -- You brought those assumptions into your analysis because of your biased views of the community. The questions they raised in their notes to the HRC are legitimate for anyone to ask. Casually Declining Handouts So I trust the ever tolerant Casual one will be standing side by side with us if the town decides to use one cent of taxpayer money to initiate any of these requests? I don't see why it would come to the Borough of Freehold to provide public transportation? Do other individual municipalities provide their own public transportation? This seems like an issue for County or State officials, perhaps those concerned are barking up the wrong tree? Health benefits. Well, Freehold Boro is already contributing money every year to the free clinic that was operating in a trailer until it moved into it's new, more permanent location. Is the Borough now expected to take up more commercial real estate by allowing other volunteer, non-profit free clinics to open up, since one is apparently not enough for the large population of people who need it? And shall we continue to funnel more tax dollars into these free clinics? This is what leads down the road to government controlled health care, which is a separate debate Child Care. The "government" already provides child care...it's called "school", and it's open to everyone. Our school system provides Pre-school through 8th grade, and then the regional system provides 9th-12th. That totals 14 years of child care. Could these groups not turn to other sources for the other times they are looking for child care? English language classes. As the article points out, the President of the School Board mentioned that the school system currently offers English language classes for adults. If you had ever been at a school board meeting when this topic was brought up, you would have learned that these classes are sparsely populated at best. The question arises about extending these classes to weekends as well. In order to do that, it will require more money, and considering the districts current financial constraints, I don't see how that could be possible. As Libyan Sybil pointed out, the group in town appears to be unorganized (though their "advocates" can hardly make the same claim). What they should be doing is going to those who claim to be looking out for them - LLA, Casa Freehold, etc - and asking them to help set up these services. Since I am such a biased...no wait...I believe the words you used were "What a snob!! What an elitist snob!!!", I have a simple view of this all. When a group of people claim they want to assimilate to the culture that they have moved into, they make the efforts to do just that, they don't request that those who are already there continue to provide means and methods for them to assimilate. I am sorry if it's rough...it was no easier for the members of my family who first came over to this country, but somehow, they were able to survive, they were able to live, they were able to assimilate...and here's the kicker, they did it all while being here legally!!! It's amazing what people were able to do back then when resources were much more scarce than they are nowadays!! But then again, that's just the opinion of an "elitist snob" |
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Post by richardkelsey on Dec 14, 2007 12:03:36 GMT -5
This might surprise a few people -- but I have no problem with lawful residents, of any heritage, lobbying for and pressing for services to benefit themselves.
Now -- read carefully -- that does not mean I support those ideas or lobbying efforts -- but it does mean that if you are a citizen here, and you want the government to give you cradle to grave jobs, money, daycare, health care, and transportation, you ought to have the right to ask for it.
Likewise, people who believe that creating government solutions in the form of dependency for the poor is not positive for either the government or the poor, should have that right to say so.
Obviously, to the extent any of those lobbying are here illegally, they have no legitimate right -- in my opinion -- or under the law, to ask for those services.
I do think the title of this thread is a bit much -- frankly. Not all Hispanics are illegal (not even close), and certainly not all are looking for free stuff.
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Dec 14, 2007 13:04:22 GMT -5
I am sorry if it's rough...it was no easier for the members of my family who first came over to this country, but somehow, they were able to survive, they were able to live, they were able to assimilate...and here's the kicker, they did it all while being here legally!!! It's amazing what people were able to do back then when resources were much more scarce than they are nowadays!! But then again, that's just the opinion of an "elitist snob" Andrew- Lets also point out the in the past, large waves of immigrants moved to large urban centers with capable infrastructure, NYC has plenty of "Affordable" housing neighborhoods, a great transportation system can the NYC Subways and ground transportation call "Bus" system. Suburban and Rural regions have never been subjected to mass immigrant influx, because they are not capable of supporting the needs. Freehold Borough is not conducive, sorry immigrants! Housing is expensive, transportation is inferior, Social Service are lacking, and why...because this is not a big city/urban center. If these living necessities are increasingly important, than you have chosen to live in the wrong region, and that reconsideration to relocation to NYC, Newark, Trenton, Phili, LA, Detroit, etc... If you feel that a Taxi is too expensive, this is a problem. If the Suburban Public Transportation is inconvenient, sorry. Childcare is less accessible, hummm  . If avenues are not designed to be safe for large volumes of Bike traffic, this is unfortunate. This is a large country with may location that lend well to alternative life styles, and know one is forced to live in Freehold Boro (unless your trying to sell your home..  ). |
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 14, 2007 14:48:46 GMT -5
This might surprise a few people -- but I have no problem with lawful residents, of any heritage, lobbying for and pressing for services to benefit themselves. Now -- read carefully -- that does not mean I support those ideas or lobbying efforts -- but it does mean that if you are a citizen here, and you want the government to give you cradle to grave jobs, money, daycare, health care, and transportation, you ought to have the right to ask for it. Likewise, people who believe that creating government solutions in the form of dependency for the poor is not positive for either the government or the poor, should have that right to say so. Obviously, to the extent any of those lobbying are here illegally, they have no legitimate right -- in my opinion -- or under the law, to ask for those services. I do think the title of this thread is a bit much -- frankly. Not all Hispanics are illegal (not even close), and certainly not all are looking for free stuff. Rich, you are right. The title of the thread was mostly meant to get people to read it. However, since from the article I can only tell that the requests for free services were made in spanish, I cannot say that only illegals request free government services - perhaps legal hispanics request them too. I don't want to be guilty of lumping all people that share a common language into one pot. I will say that the paper did a disservice by reporting a perceived stereotype - illegal immigrants requesting and getting free services. I guess, maybe, I'll have to re-think that sterotype that all hispanics who are here illegally are hard-working. Could there possibly be a negative stereotype that might ring true? (I mean a negative stereotype other than those true ones about white males). Another thing... Rich, of course, everyone legally here has the right to request free government services, but that does not mean that I have to agree that any request is proper. CR does not get that cradle to grave mentality might actually be opposed by legitimate political philosophies. |
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 14, 2007 14:53:09 GMT -5
p.s. Part of me bringing up this article was to highlight something else.
When the controversy of the HR appointment first reared its ugly head, we were told that this committee means nothing. This was particularly interesting as a person on council informed us a long time ago, that the committee solved problems and did good. When the appointment was questioned, the committee was instantly deemed a toothless paper tiger.
Now, it seems that the HR committee might have some force behing it. Look at the requests that are being presented to it, and how councilman Sims reacts (on paper, for what that is worth).
We were also told be several people that the HR committee was going to die an early death. Now, it is reported that the committee is moving on and will be stronger than ever.
So, you decide. Does this committee have any power? Do appointments to the committee mean nothing?
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adefonzo
Junior Member
If I can see further than some, it's because I have stood on the shoulders of giants
Posts: 308
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Post by adefonzo on Dec 14, 2007 15:13:10 GMT -5
Could there possibly be a negative stereotype that might ring true? (I mean a negative stereotype other than those true ones about white males).you mean the stereotype that we own everything?? ;D oh come on now...it can't be all serious on here!!! |
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Post by novillero on Dec 14, 2007 19:03:27 GMT -5
what!? did the council have a suggestion box at the fiesta?
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Post by casualreader on Dec 15, 2007 10:15:21 GMT -5
DeFonzo Dude, LS, Flipper: As I mentioned earlier the article as written mentions issues that the people attending the Latino Festival wanted more information about. It was the spin of LS that took it on this roller coaster of implied government handouts. Even at Christmas she cannot squeeze a little compassion into her itty bitty heart.  The stereotype you are promoting is unfair and uncalled for. DeFonzo dude in his response seems to have completely missed the point. He writes that the people dropping these notes want the borough to provide public transportation, health care, day care and English language classes. Nowhere in the article does it say that -- It appears that they want to find out what exists -- what is available. Nowhere does it say they want these services free. Then there is this from Flipper: News Flash for Flipper -- The Freehold area is no longer rural. We are part of one big extended urban/suburban area from NYC to Philly. More bus routes would be a great thing for the area -- they would cut down on pollution and congested roadways. Health care and day care are issues for everybody -- even in this sleepy little hamlet of discontent. These are issues anyone would ask about. The idea that someone has to move from here to address these issues seems ridiculous. Casually Citing the Obvious |
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Post by novillero on Dec 15, 2007 19:10:48 GMT -5
It certainly seems to me that some of those requests were plainly for additional service, while it could be said that other things were unclear. Clearly the phrase "requests for..." means they are requesting those items, not requesting information about the possibility of the existence of those things.
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. If avenues are not designed to be safe for large volumes of Bike traffic, this is unfortunate. 
).
