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Post by admin on Sept 18, 2006 16:53:17 GMT -5
I bring this up because it is a topic often mentioned, and rarely answered. In another thread, Fed up brought this up. Recently I was on the phone with a fine resident from our town and, again, this issue was mentioned.
Last year when PEOPLE hosted an informational public meeting, with then Superintendent Phil Meara, this topic was touched upon and not really followed through with.
Does any reader know if there is a problem with out of district students attending our schools?
Is the school system doing anything to address this issue?
Has anyone ever brought this up at a board of ed meeting?
I know that people who are from out of town and want to send their children here, can do so and get away with it fairly easy. I know it is hard for the schools to deal with these issues.
I am not posing this as an illegal immigrant issue. This is an out of district resident issue. It would make sense to me that our schools should be vigilant on this issue when there is dire need for classroom space. No one wants to hear about art rooms and music rooms being used for other purposes because of over crowding. From what I heard from my neighbor, there is a large amount of kinder-gardeners alone at the Learning Center School.
I do not have children in the schools so I am not aware of all that goes on in them. Are there any parents or teachers reading this who might have some answers?
I will turn this into a sticky thread for all to read. I believe that this is an important issue for Freehold to look into.
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Post by Wyane on Nov 16, 2006 0:32:30 GMT -5
It is my understanding that the Boro schools have very loose policies, and do not require a Lease, CO, HUD form or Prop Tax Bill, as proff of residency, as ALL other surrounding districts (Township, Marlboro, Coltsneck)... require.
Wonder why the schools are getting so over crowed? All one needs to do is to complete a simple, unchecked affidavit, and mi school es su school!
Among the illegal underground, the Boro has become a "Destination town", this being on of the reasons, easy access to free babysitting call the freehold boro schools....
Explain how the student population has grown so pervasively, forecasting 50% growth, yet there has been no major home building boom in the boro.
Attend a school board meeting and ask where all these students are coming from, and how they verify residency!
Did you know that the boro now has kindergarten, 1st grade and 2nd grade class taught in Spanish only.. and classes with 30 kids is not unusual.
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Post by admin on Nov 16, 2006 6:00:51 GMT -5
It is my understanding that the Boro schools have very loose policies, and do not require a Lease, CO, HUD form or Prop Tax Bill, as proff of residency, as ALL other surrounding districts (Township, Marlboro, Coltsneck)... require. Wonder why the schools are getting so over crowed? All one needs to do is to complete a simple, unchecked affidavit, and mi school es su school! Among the illegal underground, the Boro has become a "Destination town", this being on of the reasons, easy access to free babysitting call the freehold boro schools.... Explain how the student population has grown so pervasively, forecasting 50% growth, yet there has been no major home building boom in the boro. Attend a school board meeting and ask where all these students are coming from, and how they verify residency! Did you know that the boro now has kindergarten, 1st grade and 2nd grade class taught in Spanish only.. and classes with 30 kids is not unusual. Wyane, This post has been sitting for quite a while and you are the first to tackle the issue. Welcome to the site, it is good to have someone with cajones. |
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Post by Wyane on Nov 16, 2006 8:13:40 GMT -5
Not cajones, just that I am a homeowner, pay Taxes and am not happy with how its spent... Stay tuned!  |
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bergsteiger
Full Member
War is simple, direct, and ruthless
Posts: 1,189
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Post by bergsteiger on Nov 16, 2006 13:03:48 GMT -5
I find it humorous that you are discussing Hispanics over crowding the schools using a vulgar Spanish word for testicles. You guys need to become more culturally sensitive like me.  |
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Post by Guest on Nov 16, 2006 14:22:14 GMT -5
If you are going to use the spanish word at least use the correct spanish word, cajones, the word used above, loosely translated means drawers. The word you are looking for is cojones. ;D ...and you guys don't feel there is a need for spanish instructions in your district!  |
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Post by admin on Nov 16, 2006 15:37:20 GMT -5
If you are going to use the Spanish word at least use the correct Spanish word, cajones, the word used above, loosely translated means drawers. The word you are looking for is cojones. ;D ...and you guys don't feel there is a need for Spanish instructions in your district!  You got me! and made me laugh! ;D I never took Spanish, only Italian, although they are often similar. If I had used the English word I meant, my censorship feature would have flagged me. As an after thought, drawers is not too far off. Wyane clearly showed that he wears drawers, by his post. Many others, including those of the male gender, are wearing dresses. Yeah, I know cheap shot, the real ladies on this board will get me. And Bergstieger, you be quiet on this one, I know where you will go, let's not. ;D PS Guest, would you happen to be a " Concerned Citizen" ? |
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Post by wyane on Nov 16, 2006 15:38:53 GMT -5
Dear Guest....
"and you guys don't feel there is a need for Spanish instructions in your district!"
Correct! and you help me further establish why Boro schools are failing, there is no need for spanish instructions, education in the Boro, County, State and Country is based on an English language syllabus!
And Berg..."vulgar Spanish " how about Chutzpah is that better?
lets not digress from Brian's point, being productive bold statements that challenge complacent thinking is a welcomed and refreshing.
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Post by Guest on Nov 16, 2006 16:08:33 GMT -5
Correct! [glow=red,2,300]and you help me further establish why Boro schools are failing[/glow], there is no need for spanish instructions, education in the Boro, County, State and Country is based on an English language syllabus!
How?
PS. (Yes I am Brian)
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Post by admin on Nov 16, 2006 16:27:40 GMT -5
Correct! [glow=red,2,300]and you help me further establish why Boro schools are failing[/glow], there is no need for spanish instructions, education in the Boro, County, State and Country is based on an English language syllabus! How? PS. (Yes I am Brian) Welcome back, I do like having you.  |
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Post by wyane on Nov 17, 2006 0:37:45 GMT -5
Hi Guest I'll answer your "HOW" question with your own words.... "...and you guys don't feel there is a need for spanish instructions in your district!" NO...in fact what is needed is the opposite...there are families and students that desperately need to elevate English proficiency FAST, and starting at home would be a great concept too. |
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Post by wyane on Nov 17, 2006 1:14:26 GMT -5
"Tell me again, how is this the council's fault?"
First...While the town council in Riverside NJ., Farmers Branch TX., Hazelton PA., even Riverside CA., protect their constituent communities but put up a good fight aimed at discouraging illegal immigrants from residing or laboring in their municipalities, the Freehold Boro Council capitulated to special interests and rolls out the welcome wagon to the pervasive illicit, intent on diluting the character of this historic town, aka, the Monmouth County Seat.
"What have you been doing to solve the problem?"
I have contacted code enforcement a number of times, with success! One rental home is now vacant, due to repeated over crowing violations. Another rental home on my street has been tagged with $2000.00 on fines issues because of contraction that had started without issuance of permits. I am vigilant, and one my street we keep a watchful eye on whats going on, and who's moving in and out.
I was not born in the Boro, I chose to legally live hear, raise a family here, invest in a home here, and VOTE here.
I don't like whats happening to my investment, I don't like what my children are being exposed too, and I have reservations about the effectiveness who I have been voting for.
This is how I have formulated my opinion.....I welcome your opinion, perhaps I need to look at things differently, or we just can agree to disagree too
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Post by Guest on Nov 23, 2006 11:34:34 GMT -5
AS a former member of the School Board, I know that we addressed this issue 2-3 years ago. We required several proofs of residency within the Borough. We went as far as the law would allow. I believe we found 2 or 3 students that were not legal residents of the Borough. The problem with overcrowding in the schools is NOT out of district students, but the illegal overcrowding in the numerous legal and illegal rentals in town. Rather than taking out our frustration with this issue with the schools, which are required by law to educate all children that are residents of the Borough, we should be looking at all the Federal, State, and Local elected officals that have done nothing to correct this problem. In fact, many of them helped to create the problem. We also should look at the Immigration and Reform Act of 1996. Title 1 Subtitle C Sec. 133 makes it possible for any State or any political subdivision of the state to get permission from the Attorney General to function as an Immigration officer. I am not a lawyer but in reading the law, it seems to offer a way for states to go after illegals if they want to.
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Post by admin on Nov 23, 2006 21:17:39 GMT -5
AS a former member of the School Board, I know that we addressed this issue 2-3 years ago. We required several proofs of residency within the Borough. We went as far as the law would allow. I believe we found 2 or 3 students that were not legal residents of the Borough. The problem with overcrowding in the schools is NOT out of district students, but the illegal overcrowding in the numerous legal and illegal rentals in town. Rather than taking out our frustration with this issue with the schools, which are required by law to educate all children that are residents of the Borough, we should be looking at all the Federal, State, and Local elected officials that have done nothing to correct this problem. In fact, many of them helped to create the problem. We also should look at the Immigration and Reform Act of 1996. Title 1 Subtitle C Sec. 133 makes it possible for any State or any political subdivision of the state to get permission from the Attorney General to function as an Immigration officer. I am not a lawyer but in reading the law, it seems to offer a way for states to go after illegals if they want to. Guest, very good post. Being that you were on the schools board makes you a welcome addition to this site. I hope that you will stick around and add your thoughts and experiences to all of the topics on the site. The above post is a good start. I will only ask one small favor. Please pick a nick name or even your real name to post under. The only reason is to avoid confusion for our readers. I can tell the difference between all users, but others can not. If you wish to remain anonymous, that is fine, I will not divulge any info about any participant who wishes to keep their ID a secret. I will ask you one question. I have shown a great deal of cynicism toward any change within the schools. Do you believe I am wrong? |
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leelye
Junior Member
Posts: 150
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Post by leelye on Nov 24, 2006 8:15:55 GMT -5
If I remember correctly, when the Boro School Board decided to implement checking on the residency of their students two or three years ago, it was only on new registrants, not current students. If they had checked residency status from the beginning (it should be done annually for every student not just new registrants) like most schools do every year they would find a lot of kids either all living at the same address or living in the Stonehurst apts. or whose parents live out of town yet work in the borough and therefore feel their kids should go to school in the same town they work in. When my son was in school, the boro had a breakfast program from 8-8:30 (your child could not be dropped off sooner) which I paid for and was a help to me because of my job. I also had him enrolled in an afterschool care program run by the YMCA for which I paid for. From what I've read recently, parents had been dropping off kids as early as 7AM and leaving them there unattended until the issue was addressed. Do they pay for this early morning babysitting program or are the taxpayers footing the bill?
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Post by wyane on Nov 24, 2006 10:14:19 GMT -5
“If they had checked residency status from the beginning (it should be done annually for every student not just new registrants) like most schools do every year they would find a lot of kids either all living at the same address or living in the Stonehurst apts.” ….. Right on!!! Most Districts REQUIRE a “PROPER” proof or residency documentation…like a Tax Bill, HUD Form (“legal” homeless families who are recipient of public assistance, living in temporary housing), or a copy of a “lawful” “legitimate”, “official” lease (AS I understand it, any goofy “letter” from a “landlord” is acceptable form of documentation, and is NOT CHECKED!!!). Admittance to our schools is as porous as out boarders!
“……or whose parents live out of town yet work in the borough and therefore feel their kids should go to school in the same town they work in. OK No Problem”….How about our district charges their district the Standard Tuition Fees plus 15% admin fee. However, not while Boro schools are seriously Overcrowded!
“From what I've read recently, parents had been dropping off kids as early as 7AM and leaving them there unattended until the issue was addressed”. ..Not true, I am sure the police and DYFS would get involved, What parent leaves there child unattended at a close school??? Boro pre-school day, and aftercare is played for buy the parents or Fed Funded for those who qualify, however I’d like to know if ALL expenses from these programs are covered by the revenue coming in from the Parents, i.e, is this program running Red or Black?
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Post by fedup on Nov 24, 2006 11:26:52 GMT -5
AS a former member of the School Board, I know that we addressed this issue 2-3 years ago. We required several proofs of residency within the Borough. We went as far as the law would allow. I believe we found 2 or 3 students that were not legal residents of the Borough. Thanks for the info. Were the parents of the "2 or 3" students illegally attending classes at Borough schools required to reimburse the district? (And if not, why? That is, after all, SOP in such cases...) |
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Post by Informed Guest on Dec 2, 2006 13:44:41 GMT -5
It amazes me how much people speak about things that they really know nothing about. The State of New Jersey is extremely strict as to what can and can't be asked for when registering a student for school. Throw in the fact that various signed affadavits must be accepted with no questions asked and the fact that the school district can't share student information with the Borough administration for the purposes of investigating the so called "illegal residences" and the hands of the school district are pretty much tied. It is their charge to educate the students they are presented with to the best of their ability. This includes students of all races, creeds and colors as well as learning ability. The school district has no authority over illegal residences. That is the responsibility of the Borough administration and code enforcement.
Over crowding and test scores are things that need to be addressed. It's my understanding that the district is trying to adjust curriculum and gain better understanding of where the problems lie through data analysis. These things take time and change can't be measured immediately. I'm not sure whether or not most of you know but poor test scores begin to have a punitive effect financial effect on the district in the area of federal funding. Spanish speaking students are a part of the student population that needs to be addressed if the scores are to increase to acceptable levels. This is also true in the area of special education students and economically disadvantaged students.
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Born to Run far away
Guest
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Post by Born to Run far away on Dec 2, 2006 14:51:57 GMT -5
... to all of the recent influx of BOE insiders and apologists. We'd been considering making the big move (out of the Borough) and your postings have helped us finally decide that doing so is the only sensible course of action.
Good luck to (and God help) the rest of you.
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Post by sonofsilencedogood on Dec 2, 2006 18:47:27 GMT -5
This is the first post that I will be submitting to this site, but it certainly will not be the last. After reading an awful lot of what is on this site, I have been motivated to put my two cents in as well.
I'll stay on the topic of this particular forum by saying that, as Informed Guest has stated, there are laws, state and federal laws that the board of Ed has to adhere to. Born to run...we are not apologists for the board, we are simply the ones who have a better understanding the restrictions that they are bound to. If you have decided to "Run away", I would assume you do not have the fire in you to stand and fight for something you believe in, so I wish you well.
The Freehold Boro Board of Education is NOT a legislative body. The Board of Ed is NOT able to make their own laws. The Board of Ed does make policy, but they are based on, and have to fall within the guidelines of, state and federal laws. For all of you who want to continuously bash the Board of Ed, take the time to learn the laws that govern them. I have been to Board of Ed meetings, how many of you have? I have talked to members of the Board of Ed and have come to realize the struggles the BOE faces.
The Board of Ed is not some advocacy group for the illegal population in Freehold. The BOE has a very basic responsibility, to find a way to provide the best possible education for any child who can prove they live within the town.
If you, as residents of this town, this county, this state and this nation have a problem with the laws that are governing the Board of Ed's actions, TAKE IT UP WITH THE LEGISLATIVE BODIES OF THE TOWN, COUNTY, STATE, AND FEDERAL GOVERNMENT!!! Stop electing the same people into office over and over and over and over and over again!!! Learn the law. Understand who can affect the law, and then go to them for change.
At the very least, stop posting nasty comments on here about the Board of Ed, and show up at a meeting to bring your concerns directly to the source. After you have heard from the board, perhaps you will come to better understand, as I have, the limitations and problems. Then, perhaps you can work with the board to try and come up with solutions.
Son of Silence Dogood
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Post by Wyane on Dec 2, 2006 23:45:15 GMT -5
... to all of the recent influx of BOE insiders and apologists. We'd been considering making the big move (out of the Borough) and your postings have helped us finally decide that doing so is the only sensible course of action. Good luck to (and God help) the rest of you. Great job Tablero de la Educación..as well, Son of .. and Informed.... |
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Post by Wyane on Dec 2, 2006 23:51:46 GMT -5
... to all of the recent influx of BOE insiders and apologists. We'd been considering making the big move (out of the Borough) and your postings have helped us finally decide that doing so is the only sensible course of action. Good luck to (and God help) the rest of you. Great job Tablero de la Educación..as well, Son of .. and Informed.... BTW..Born to Run....You have kinds in our schools? You attended any school board meetings....ever? Before your cash in your chips, and spilt this popsical stand...please, go attend a meeting and make sure you leave a few departing words....and place sell to a nice family who will not add to our ESL population. |
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Post by BTRFA on Dec 3, 2006 18:34:01 GMT -5
According to the Freehold Township BOE website, these are their standard for enrollment :
RESIDENCY: Two Proofs of Residency
NOTE: Parents must reside in Freehold Township in order to register their child. Parents who have entered into a contract to purchase or lease a home, but have not yet moved into the township, are not eligible to register. The following may be used as proof of residency: (A post office box number is not considered proof of residency)
*a valid NJ driver's license showing current address
*a rent receipt or lease agreement
*voter registration card
*property tax bill
*utility bill
*mortgage document or deed for property
Has the Borough BOE considered filing a complaint or entering into legal action against Freehold Township? By adopting what FBBOE claims are more stringent standards than are allowed by law, the Township is very likely funneling students who reside within the Twp, but who cannot provide documentation within their narrow criteria, into the Borough schools. This, of course, has a financially deleterious effect on not only Freehold Borough's taxpaying residents, but also on the students legitimately enrolled in our schools.
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 3, 2006 22:01:53 GMT -5
If you have decided to "Run away", I would assume you do not have the fire in you to stand and fight for something you believe in, so I wish you well. Silence, love the name. Anyway, the question is not why some one would "run" from this fight, but why should they stay if they feel that their child will not be getting a good education? Why should Born to Run have his children be the guinea pigs? Why should Born to Run subject his children to what he obviously feels are inferior schools? How long should a parent subject his child to overcrowded schools? Should they wait until the money pours from heaven that will fix that problem, and if the money came today, how long would it take until their was enough class rooms to get the boro classes down to manageable sizes? Why fight when his children will have to wait years for improved academics and smaller class sizes? This is not a game where we can call people "cowards" and use phrases like "run away" or "cut and run", this is one of the most serious parental responsibilities of Born to Run. This is not running, but taking responsibility for the education of his child. (Of course, Born to Run, has already conceded much of his parental control for educating his children by giving them to strangers for 8 hours a day, but, hey, that is another story.) |
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Post by wyane on Dec 3, 2006 22:55:21 GMT -5
BTRFA ...in a round about way you further establish my point...The township has tough enrolment standards, and the Boro has NOT!
BTRFA...got o a broad meeting and ASK THEM!!!!
In Fact, The Township Standards are in line to MOST other communiites! We are NOT!
We allow the BOE to Overtrun our NO Vote, The Township did not!
Boro Schools are FAILING, Township is NOT
Township (note their Hispanics...)Grade 3
Language Arts Literacy This District
All Students 94%
Asian 97%
Black 80%
Hispanic 89%
White 95%
Economically disadvantaged 84%
Non-economically disadvantaged 94%
Female 97%
Male 90%
Special education 78%
General education 97%
Non-migrant 94%
The Boro...(note our Hispanics)
Grade 3
Language Arts Literacy This School
All Students 62%
Black 67%
Hispanic 45%
White 86%
Economically disadvantaged 50%
Non-economically disadvantaged 77%
Female 59%
Male 65%
Special education 50%
General education 77%
Non-migrant 62%
By Born to Run Family!!!!!
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Post by sonofsilencedogood on Dec 3, 2006 23:36:33 GMT -5
First of all let me say that I can understand Born to Run's responsibility to his children...but let me ask you...will he continue to care about this issue once he is comfortably living in another town that does not seem to be dealing with such a large illegal population? My guess, and it has been proved right with others I know who have moved away, is, as the old saying goes, "out of sight, out of mind". That's where my concern is.
Let me also clear something else up, I have heard several times, and probably not all in this forum, about how the BOE went and got the "no" vote overturned, and in many posts it said they got it overturned on the referendum. Let me first say this, the only vote that was overturned was on the school budget, not the referendum. The budget that was put out there, from what I have heard since I personally have not seen it, was below even a "bare bones" budget. It was so far below that the town council did not directly overturn the no vote because they felt that the budget was not enough to provide a "thorough and efficient" education for our students.
But that's all for another forum.
BTRFA, I pray you bring that information down to the BOE meeting on Monday night (the 4th at 7pm at the Park Avenue school library). Find out from the board directly why their regulations are the way they are. Also, take a look a the other forum I started, Laws Regarding Student Residency, as there is a direct link to the actual verbiage of the law. As for the Township, I don't have an answer, which is why I say bring it to the board. Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that they simply do not have the illegal population that we have, so there has never been a strong enough challenge to their requirements? I simply do not know.
I will say it again, and I will continue to say it until I see something come of it...go to board meetings, express your concerns. If you approach the issue as an attack and throw insults at the board, be prepared to not get a positive response (that's true anywhere in life). If you approach it as "this is what I am concerned about, I would like an answer, and I would love to help the board in any way I might be able to in order to resolve the issue", you'll be surprised with the response you'll get. But first, you have to go to the meetings, stand up, and make yourself heard.
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Post by wyane on Dec 4, 2006 0:32:53 GMT -5
www.njsbf.com/njsbf/publications/residency_requirements.cfm#8RIGHTS OF STUDENTS APPLYING FOR ADMISSION TO THE DISTRICT Proof of Eligibility Acceptable forms of documentation include, but are not limited to, the following: property tax bills, mortgages, signed letters from landlords, voter registrations, licenses, permits, utility bills, court orders, receipts, bills, medical reports, employment documents, affidavits, and documents pertaining to military status or assignment.67 RATHER than spending god know how much money on a MARKETING Campaign with Zander, who will market a force feeding of the budget referendom. This community would be better serverd by an investment in legal STUDY ( I bet the Boro is not the ONLY school district with these problems, so there is economy with SHARED Legal Services) that challenges the legal doctrines you so fear (Luke, face your fears, let the force guild you). I grew up in rental apartments, and I know what my parents had to supply the schools with EVERY YEAR! With a copy of the lease, I gained NO admittance! Frankly...MAKE THE STAND, and I guarantee the home owners of this town will support you 99.99% (there are a few hold-outs). I'd rather see my taxes go up to support a worth while Legal Battle, then having my vote overturned because the BOE is not willing to challenge Felons, and those who provide safe harbor! "They are Volunteers" you say. So where's the Fire and Passion? Who would find fault with standing up for whats IS RIGHT? "not limited to"...This means discretion is allowed! Pick and Chose..
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 4, 2006 1:07:56 GMT -5
Here's a question. There is no doubt that the courts have ruled that the local schools must educate children regardless of their status - so it is worthless to argue against that, the question is - Is this a problem? Think about it? Who the heck out there thinks that Mexicans (I assume that is who we are really talking about) living in the neighboring towns (Freehold Twsp, Colts Neck, Howell, Manalapan, Marlboro, Millstone) are trying to go to Freehold Borough schools? Why go through the hassle when those town systems are probably closer to the kids home, and the schools are either equal to the boro or better? Perhaps this is a problem for the High School, but not the K-8.
The problem with out of district students is usually in towns that have a reputation for doing academically well, and is usually done by parents trying to get their children away from so-called bad influences.
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Dec 4, 2006 9:48:53 GMT -5
Here's a question. There is no doubt that the courts have ruled that the local schools must educate children regardless of their status - so it is worthless to argue against that, the question is - Is this a problem? Think about it? Who the heck out there thinks that Mexicans (I assume that is who we are really talking about) living in the neighboring towns (Freehold Twsp, Colts Neck, Howell, Manalapan, Marlboro, Millstone) are trying to go to Freehold Borough schools? Why go through the hassle when those town systems are probably closer to the kids home, and the schools are either equal to the boro or better? Perhaps this is a problem for the High School, but not the K-8. The problem with out of district students is usually in towns that have a reputation for doing academically well, and is usually done by parents trying to get their children away from so-called bad influences. Do people really think students from outside the borough are trying to knock down the walls to get into a district failing NCLB? |
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Post by guest on Feb 11, 2007 20:57:12 GMT -5
Geo,
I hope you're sharing that information with someone in administration at the schools so that they may take the appropriate action.
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You got me! and made me laugh! ;D I never took Spanish, only Italian, although they are often similar. If I had used the English word I meant, my censorship feature would have flagged me.
