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Post by admin on Jul 11, 2007 5:38:20 GMT -5
Law says outside fires must be out by 1 a.m. FREEHOLD - Borough officials have introduced an amendment to an existing law which regulates the use of outdoor fireplaces. A public hearing and vote on the amendment is expected to take place in August. According to the law, open burning in approved containers will be allowed without a permit at single-family homes, duplexes and townhomes. The amendment concerns the time when the fires must be extinguished - no later than 1 a.m. Councilman Marc Le Vine raised the issue several months ago. He noted that homes in the borough are close together and said municipal officials must be concerned with the use of fire pits and chimineas. The code that was presented to the Borough Council on June 18 states that fires must be limited to a maximum 3-foot diameter and 2-foot height and must be contained in a non-combustible chiminea (outdoor fireplace), fire pit or other method approved by a fire prevention officer. According to the ordinance, all openings in the chiminea or the fire pit must be covered with wire mesh or other screening material that will prevent the passage of sparks and embers. The fire must be kept at least 10 feet away from any structure or combustible exterior wall. The fire must be constantly attended and may not be used on any porch, deck, balcony or any other portion of a building within any room or space under any building overhang. The ordinance also prohibits the burning of yard waste, leaves, brush, vines, evergreen needles and branches smaller than 3 inches in diameter, treated lumber, garbage, paper products or any other products other than firewood. The fire prevention office, police officers or code enforcement officials may order any fire which creates a nuisance to be extinguished. Anyone found guilty of violating the law would be subject to a fine up to $1,250 or to imprisonment, not to exceed 90 days, or both. - Clare Marie Celano newstranscript.gmnews.com/news/2007/0711/Front_Page/008.html |
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bergsteiger
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Post by bergsteiger on Jul 11, 2007 7:08:33 GMT -5
What is point of putting out the fire by 1am? Why not 1:30am? What will happen if the fire is burning at 2am other then the law showing up?
I heard trans fat would migrate into your unsealed food items if the fire is still burning at 3am, is that true?
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adefonzo
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Post by adefonzo on Jul 11, 2007 9:28:24 GMT -5
Law says outside fires must be out by 1 a.m. FREEHOLD - Borough officials have introduced an amendment to an existing law which regulates the use of outdoor fireplaces. A public hearing and vote on the amendment is expected to take place in August. According to the law, open burning in approved containers will be allowed without a permit at single-family homes, duplexes and townhomes. The amendment concerns the time when the fires must be extinguished - no later than 1 a.m. Councilman Marc Le Vine raised the issue several months ago. He noted that homes in the borough are close together and said municipal officials must be concerned with the use of fire pits and chimineas. The code that was presented to the Borough Council on June 18 states that fires must be limited to a maximum 3-foot diameter and 2-foot height and must be contained in a non-combustible chiminea (outdoor fireplace), fire pit or other method approved by a fire prevention officer. According to the ordinance, all openings in the chiminea or the fire pit must be covered with wire mesh or other screening material that will prevent the passage of sparks and embers. The fire must be kept at least 10 feet away from any structure or combustible exterior wall. The fire must be constantly attended and may not be used on any porch, deck, balcony or any other portion of a building within any room or space under any building overhang. The ordinance also prohibits the burning of yard waste, leaves, brush, vines, evergreen needles and branches smaller than 3 inches in diameter, treated lumber, garbage, paper products or any other products other than firewood. The fire prevention office, police officers or code enforcement officials may order any fire which creates a nuisance to be extinguished. Anyone found guilty of violating the law would be subject to a fine up to $1,250 or to imprisonment, not to exceed 90 days, or both. - Clare Marie Celano newstranscript.gmnews.com/news/2007/0711/Front_Page/008.htmlI realize this may come off sounding like I am being a pain in the a$$, but they are real questions that I would like to have answered... If I build a brick fire pit in my backyard, 3 feet wide by 2 feet high, and then cover it with wire mesh...how am I going to enjoy a fire in my backyard that I can't see?? Also...who's going to protect me from burning my hands when I move the wire mesh in order to put more wood on the fire?? Next...I see I am not allowed to burn branches smaller than 3 inches, paper products, or anything other than firewood. How do I get a fire started if I can't use newspaper and small kindling (small branches), or some sort of fire starter log?? I have never been able to master the art of putting a match to a large log and magically have it start right up without some sort of paper, or kindling, or other fire starting aid. And finally, when is the town scheduling the fire safety classes that will teach people how to be responsible when having a fire pit in their backyard? This who topic came about (I am assuming) because "the town" was concerned with people acting safely if they want to have these fire pits and chimneas...so when is the town offering a fire safety class to teach people how to be responsible? Or is the town just going to put the law in place, and then issue summonses when people don't act according to the law? Perhaps at this class we can learn how to start a fire without the paper, kindling, or other fire starters as I mentioned before? Perhaps these questions would be better asked on the 16th at the workshop meeting... |
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bergsteiger
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Post by bergsteiger on Jul 11, 2007 10:08:50 GMT -5
Adefonzo, Most backcountry campsites in N.J. fires are not allowed. In N.Y. backcountry campsite fires are allowed using twigs no larger then 3 inches. That makes sense because it would keep the fire to a manageable size. No mention of kerosene or gasoline so I guess you going to have to start the fire with one of those. Let me suggest that you use kerosene; it smells worse but burns slower and longer. Soak the wood real good before you throw a match on it.  If you were taught in school how to build a fire and fire safety instead of wasting time in Spanish class you would have a usable skill now. Try telling the wood to burn in Spanish maybe it will help.  |
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adefonzo
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Post by adefonzo on Jul 11, 2007 10:31:43 GMT -5
Adefonzo, Most backcountry campsites in N.J. fires are not allowed. In N.Y. backcountry campsite fires are allowed using twigs no larger then 3 inches. That makes sense because it would keep the fire to a manageable size. No mention of kerosene or gasoline so I guess you going to have to start the fire with one of those. Let me suggest that you use kerosene; it smells worse but burns slower and longer. Soak the wood real good before you throw a match on it. If you were taught in school how to build a fire and fire safety instead of wasting time in Spanish class you would have a usable skill now. Try telling the wood to burn in Spanish maybe it will help. Actually General, I learned how to build fires back in my boy scouting days...got rather good at it too, but still can't start a fire without some sort of kindling. I appreciate the tip about the kerosene...but somehow I think the Boro would see that as "any other products other than firewood". Used to start campfires with white birch bark...but we had to stuff that with twigs!!! DARN!!! FOILED AGAIN!!! |
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Post by Marc LeVine on Jul 11, 2007 11:05:22 GMT -5
Andrew --
First of all...yes...come and ask questions at the meeting. This is what the open public portion is designed for.
Secondly, education/safety classes? I doubt that anyone would argue against something like that. I just hope enough people would care to attend. In fact, I'll be glad to discuss the thought of offering safety classes, that might include general fire safety issues, with the fire commishioners and the full council at an upcoming workshop.
In addition to publishing the materials on our web site and sending them out with future water bills, the details have already appeared in the local newspapers a couple of times.
As for the "burning" details, themselves. They are culled from a variety of other town ordinances, state fire prevention statutes, equipment manufacturer's directions, tenant association requirements and other generally accepted sources. Believe me - Freehold Borough didn't make them up.
As for enjoying the fire through mesh? Check the fire pits and Chimineas sold in stores. They are all constructed with mesh to reduce the release of burning cinders. Still, people buy them because there remains plenty of fire to be enjoyed for ambiance and for warmth.
Certainly, come to the meeting and share your concerns, in public.
Marc
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adefonzo
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If I can see further than some, it's because I have stood on the shoulders of giants
Posts: 308
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Post by adefonzo on Jul 11, 2007 15:27:02 GMT -5
Marc, I will be there on the 16th to discuss this...I just hope the council doesn't take my expressing my opinion as a resident of the Boro, as some sort of divide between them and any organization that I may be involved with  As elected officials, I would hope the council more than anyone else can realize that people are capable of dealing professionally with another elected body, but still allowed to question things as a private citizen. Next...in regards to the classes, you're right, I doubt there would be much interest in them at all...but to be very frank, sometimes the elected body has to do all it can despite the apathy of the community, if for no other reason than to be able to say, "Hey, we offered classes on fire safety where we went over all of this, where were you?". I know, I know...this is not a very popular way to act as a politician, but when apathy runs rampant (as it does in today's society), it's better to offer the class and have no one show up than to not even offer it in the first place. As for my concerns about actually starting a fire...and your response as to where the Boro pulled it's language for the law from...the problem still remains that with the current wording, I don't see how someone could get their fire started! I understand the wording was taken from other sources, but that doesn't mean the Boro couldn't make changes once the process was thought through. I am sure the wording of the law was available to the public before it was actually voted into law, but unfortunately, I did not see specifics as I do now, so I could not bring up these concerns earlier. What are the odds that someone will come into my backyard and write me a summons if I am using newspaper and twigs to start a fire in a properly laid out pit? I would hope the odds are slim to none...but the fact remains that technically, that is the wording of the law, so there is always that possibility. These will all be things that I'll bring up Monday night. |
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Post by Marc LeVine on Jul 11, 2007 15:43:05 GMT -5
First of all...come...speak as a resident. This is not such a contentious issue that you need to be concerned about other hats you may wear. We expect civility to be the order of the day, anyway.
As for word changes...absolutely, they can be considered. If there is something overlooked that makes sense to re-address...well...again that's why we open this up to the public.
By the way, the supermarkets carry special kindling logs that actually burn as they are and are easily ignited. You may want to look into these.
My point about not inventing the ground rules for fire safety was only to demonstrate that there has already been much consideration given to the use of Outdoor Fireplaces and our consideration of them is consistent with how many others are addressing their use. Again, not to say we can't consider tweaking a word or two.
Thanks,
Marc
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Post by Pyro on Jul 11, 2007 17:25:06 GMT -5
Marc, I will be there on the 16th to discuss this...I just hope the council doesn't take my expressing my opinion as a resident of the Boro, as some sort of divide between them and any organization that I may be involved with As elected officials, I would hope the council more than anyone else can realize that people are capable of dealing professionally with another elected body, but still allowed to question things as a private citizen. Next...in regards to the classes, you're right, I doubt there would be much interest in them at all...but to be very frank, sometimes the elected body has to do all it can despite the apathy of the community, if for no other reason than to be able to say, "Hey, we offered classes on fire safety where we went over all of this, where were you?". I know, I know...this is not a very popular way to act as a politician, but when apathy runs rampant (as it does in today's society), it's better to offer the class and have no one show up than to not even offer it in the first place. As for my concerns about actually starting a fire...and your response as to where the Boro pulled it's language for the law from...the problem still remains that with the current wording, I don't see how someone could get their fire started! I understand the wording was taken from other sources, but that doesn't mean the Boro couldn't make changes once the process was thought through. I am sure the wording of the law was available to the public before it was actually voted into law, but unfortunately, I did not see specifics as I do now, so I could not bring up these concerns earlier. What are the odds that someone will come into my backyard and write me a summons if I am using newspaper and twigs to start a fire in a properly laid out pit? I would hope the odds are slim to none...but the fact remains that technically, that is the wording of the law, so there is always that possibility. These will all be things that I'll bring up Monday night. Andrew, Burn what you want! Code enforcement can't even catch 109 Main Street let alone if you have a spark arrester on your fire pit. Let me know when and where and I will bring the beer and marshmellows. |
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adefonzo
Junior Member
If I can see further than some, it's because I have stood on the shoulders of giants
Posts: 308
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Post by adefonzo on Jul 17, 2007 5:55:54 GMT -5
Well...I have to ask...where does one find out that the Town Council Workshop Meeting has been canceled before they show up down at Boro Hall to find it all locked up? There were a few of us standing around outside last night not knowing what was going on. There was nothing on the Boro website, and nothing that we saw posted on the door to Boro Hall either.
I was there, Marc...ready to delve into the issues. Unfortunately, I must have missed the notice that the meeting was cancelled.
Where do I look next time so that I don't have to run out of work if it's not necessary?
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Post by admin on Jul 17, 2007 6:01:01 GMT -5
Well...I have to ask...where does one find out that the Town Council Workshop Meeting has been canceled before they show up down at Boro Hall to find it all locked up? There were a few of us standing around outside last night not knowing what was going on. There was nothing on the Boro website, and nothing that we saw posted on the door to Boro Hall either. I was there, Marc...ready to delve into the issues. Unfortunately, I must have missed the notice that the meeting was canceled. Where do I look next time so that I don't have to run out of work if it's not necessary? You have to call the Borough clerk. Other than that finding out about cancellations turns into the experience you had last night. I have had the same happen to me. I have to take this time to get a plug in here. You would think that the council, many of whom read this site, would post something here. After all, this site readers and participants do go to council meetings on a regular basis. |
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Post by just a guy on Jul 30, 2007 15:31:01 GMT -5
Marc, I will be there on the 16th to discuss this...I just hope the council doesn't take my expressing my opinion as a resident of the Boro, as some sort of divide between them and any organization that I may be involved with As elected officials, I would hope the council more than anyone else can realize that people are capable of dealing professionally with another elected body, but still allowed to question things as a private citizen. Next...in regards to the classes, you're right, I doubt there would be much interest in them at all...but to be very frank, sometimes the elected body has to do all it can despite the apathy of the community, if for no other reason than to be able to say, "Hey, we offered classes on fire safety where we went over all of this, where were you?". I know, I know...this is not a very popular way to act as a politician, but when apathy runs rampant (as it does in today's society), it's better to offer the class and have no one show up than to not even offer it in the first place. As for my concerns about actually starting a fire...and your response as to where the Boro pulled it's language for the law from...the problem still remains that with the current wording, I don't see how someone could get their fire started! I understand the wording was taken from other sources, but that doesn't mean the Boro couldn't make changes once the process was thought through. I am sure the wording of the law was available to the public before it was actually voted into law, but unfortunately, I did not see specifics as I do now, so I could not bring up these concerns earlier. What are the odds that someone will come into my backyard and write me a summons if I am using newspaper and twigs to start a fire in a properly laid out pit? I would hope the odds are slim to none...but the fact remains that technically, that is the wording of the law, so there is always that possibility. These will all be things that I'll bring up Monday night.
Burn what you want! Code enforcement can't even catch 109 Main Street let alone if you have a spark arrester on your fire pit. Let me know when and where and I will bring the beer and marshmellows. Actually...watch out Andrew...as it so often happens in our country, the police (or code enforcers in this case) seem to overlook violations being committed by those who will never pay the fines, and concentrate on those who have something to lose by not paying the fines... i.e. the law abiding, property owning, trying to do the right thing in life citizens. One of the best examples of this (even though it's not in Freehold)...go into Manhattan (where I and many others work). On the Upper East Side and Upper West Side, there are parking meters on all of the Avenues. Parking meters lead to money for the city, either through the actual quarters collected, or through the parking tickets issued when someone parks but doesn't feed the meter. Then go up into Harlem and Spanish Harlem...no more meters!!! Why? Isn't this another residential area, just like the East and West side?? Why is it in these areas, there are no parking meters to collect money for the city? I'll leave the answer to your own imaginations. I was actually in a court room in Manalapan the other day (for a ticket I received) and heard a judge admit to the fact that there are times when the legal system does not pursue illegal immigrants and others who would ignore the violations, fines, or other penalties, because it takes too much time and effort for the court to go after a dead end!!! What kind of statement does that make about our legal system in general?  And don't think the illegals don't realize that!!! Do you see the look in their eyes when they're walking around town?? They look at the rest of us with absolute confidence that we are not going to do a darn thing about them being here illegally, and as we have seen time and time again...they're right!!! But Andrew...believe me...the first time you light a fire in your backyard and the code enforcers find out about it...there will be someone knocking on your door writing a violation for it. Why? They know you're going to pay in order to avoid losing what you've worked so hard to obtain. |
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adefonzo
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If I can see further than some, it's because I have stood on the shoulders of giants
Posts: 308
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Post by adefonzo on Sept 26, 2007 16:16:01 GMT -5
I just had to drag this thread back out of the basement...after all, we are getting into the cooler nights, which is the perfect time for a small fire in the backyard.
To be completely honest, I have been extremely busy at work as of late (which is why I was away from this site for so long), so I do not recall hearing any news about the town offering any type of fire safety course.
Now that we're coming into what I would consider the backyard fire season (who has a fire in the middle of the summer??), I think it would be a good opportunity for the town to hold this fire safety class.
I'll keep my eyes and ears open.
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As elected officials, I would hope the council more than anyone else can realize that people are capable of dealing professionally with another elected body, but still allowed to question things as a private citizen.
And don't think the illegals don't realize that!!! Do you see the look in their eyes when they're walking around town?? They look at the rest of us with absolute confidence that we are not going to do a darn thing about them being here illegally, and as we have seen time and time again...they're right!!!