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Post by cheryl on Oct 24, 2007 10:26:29 GMT -5
Was it mentioned that the Boro and Township should together, pass a proclamation giving Jersey freeze LANDMARK Status, if not too late? Landmark status as... what? A historic asset? It doesn't meet any of the established criteria for that. And it isn't even in the Borough; any "landmarking" activity would have to be on the part of the township's HPAC. Maybe I'm missing something, but wouldn't a better solution be for the Zoning Board to simply vote "no" based on the fact that the application is completely non-conforming under zoning and the Borough Master Plan? |
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Post by stffgpr2003 on Oct 24, 2007 12:59:01 GMT -5
There are two issues here. Does the use conform? And, can a 60 year old man retire after countless years on his feet?
The Zoning board will determine the former and Bill Blackmore, himself, will decide on the latter. Should the Olive Garden not be a go, let's just hope that someone, who really understands Jersey Freeze's secrets of success, takes it over and helps preserve its lofty legacy.
There is one thing worse than losing a special place to closure and that is turning it over to others to run, who might tarnish its great memories. After 50 years, Jersey Freeze is held to a very high standard by many generations of Western Monmouth County residents and visitors to the area, who remember what great ice cream tastes like.
The Zoning Board reconvenes on this topic in late November, allowing us all to "get our last licks (of Bavarian Chocolate)."
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Oct 24, 2007 13:35:38 GMT -5
There are two issues here. Does the use conform? And, can a 60 year old man retire after countless years on his feet? The Zoning board will determine the former and Bill Blackmore, himself, will decide on the latter. Should the Olive Garden not be a go, let's just hope that someone, who really understands Jersey Freeze's secrets of success, takes it over and helps preserve its lofty legacy. There is one thing worse than losing a special place to closure and that is turning it over to others to run, who might tarnish its great memories. After 50 years, Jersey Freeze is held to a very high standard by many generations of Western Monmouth County residents and visitors to the area, who remember what great ice cream tastes like. The Zoning Board reconvenes on this topic in late November, allowing us all to "get our last licks (of Bavarian Chocolate)." Hello... LANDMARC STATUS PLEASE!!!! Help this guy find a decent NEW owner, and he can make a few buck to retire on! Give a him a break, at least he only hires School kids than NEED the work, and will not let his parking lot becom a hiring hall! Help the Guy or Zone it for Office space, we need the ratable, and the Boro does not have must Rt9 Faceing real estate! We do NOT NEED AN OLIVE GARDEN! Can we start another MOVEMENT HERE!!! [/color] voteted.blogspot.com[/move][/center][/font][/u] |
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Post by cheryl on Oct 24, 2007 15:32:09 GMT -5
Hello... LANDMARC STATUS PLEASE!!!! Hello, how can one town "landmarc" something in another town (or township, in this case)? And what do you believe landmarking would accomplish, if it were even possible?  |
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Oct 24, 2007 16:04:11 GMT -5
Hello... LANDMARC STATUS PLEASE!!!! OK I was waiting for MARC to pick up on LANDMARC. On topic...If it was feasible A- it would help the current owner receive a very reasonable offer for the establishment and it would help the perspective new owner want to maintain the business, as well as market the business as a "NJ Institution", as seen on the "FOOD NETWORK" top 10 Ice cream shops in the US!!! I can not understand why this place has to go away? Almost as bad as Nathans in Coney Island going away! OK I have gotten attached since living here. www.foodnetwork.com/food/show_cw/episode/0,,FOOD_9955_20678,00.html newstranscript.gmnews.com/News/2000/0816/Front_Page/02.htmlLook at Hoffamans in Spring Lake! www.hoffmansicecream.net/Someone saved Hoffmans! Ohh and B- maybe we can find an investor who would RELOCATE JERSEY FREEZE TO DOWNTOWN. I realy cool, historic landmark icecream parlor would SUPER for downtown, with an old fashion counter and soda jerks! Could become the NEW Landmark and a Downtown attraction! MORE TO THE POINT...is the structure in the Township? We need to pressure them to not allow this ICON of both Freeholds to vanish into the Rt 9 Commercialization abyss! |
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Post by cheryl on Oct 24, 2007 16:23:27 GMT -5
MORE TO THE POINT...is the structure in the Township? Yes. |
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Oct 25, 2007 14:26:20 GMT -5
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Oct 25, 2007 14:57:49 GMT -5
I forget if it was on this thread or somewhere else (I can't find it right now). I remember that this area where the Olive Garden is going in FB is not zoned for such use as per the master plan. Remember that this area is zoned residential, and that restaurants are not included in that use.
Even though the racetrack and its parking lot are nearby, it's still zoned residential (you can't argue just because one exception was made that all exceptions must be allowed). And a restaurant is substantially more intrusive and different than some sort of retail store or office building, let alone just a home (remember Jersey Freeze knocked down a home/realtor office on that site).
So the question that really needs to be addressed is how does an Olive Garden, or any restaurant for that matter, benefit the borough in that residential area.
Is there a benefit? What are the risks/downsides? Are the risks/downsides substantially outweighed by the benefits?
I can't see any benefit aside from a rateable, and I would bet dollars to donuts that this is not a proper criteria for consideration.
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Oct 25, 2007 15:03:34 GMT -5
CONVINCE ME THIS WILL BE THE BEST TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT FOR THIS LOCATION!
We posted at the same time. I don't think there is an answer, expecially when it is something that will be against the master plan. |
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Oct 25, 2007 15:10:34 GMT -5
Maybe the master plan needs to be revisited, and the community polled.
Rather than an office complex, a modern suite of office "condos" can be concidered?
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Oct 25, 2007 15:10:52 GMT -5
Maybe the master plan needs to be revisited, and the community polled.
Rather than an office complex, a modern suite of office "condos" can be considered?
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Post by cheryl on Oct 25, 2007 15:11:57 GMT -5
Again, I am just curious, what benefit is an Olive Garden, other than a Liquor license, over a rateable that would bring in More revenue and create more REAL Jobs like an colonial style appropriately Sized OFFICE COMPLEX? The Borough already has excess and perpetually vacant office space on West Main Street, with more under construction and approvals in place for even more. What is your reasoning behind calling for yet another office building, beyond the fact that offices are considered a "clean" rateable? (And why "Colonial Style"?) And do you believe that zoning, the Borough master plan and the stability of a neighborhood should be tossed aside in a "rateable chase"? |
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Post by cheryl on Oct 25, 2007 15:30:33 GMT -5
So the question that really needs to be addressed is how does an Olive Garden, or any restaurant for that matter, benefit the borough in that residential area. That is the big question, isn't it? After all, if the Borough believed "restaurant" (or "office condo", for that matter) was an appropriate use for the neighborhood, it has had ample opportunity to zone it for that use. |
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Oct 25, 2007 16:14:30 GMT -5
Again, I am just curious, what benefit is an Olive Garden, other than a Liquor license, over a rateable that would bring in More revenue and create more REAL Jobs like an colonial style appropriately Sized OFFICE COMPLEX? The Borough already has excess and perpetually vacant office space on West Main Street, with more under construction and approvals in place for even more. What is your reasoning behind calling for yet another office building, beyond the fact that offices are considered a "clean" rateable? (And why "Colonial Style"?) And do you believe that zoning, the Borough master plan and the stability of a neighborhood should be tossed aside in a "rateable chase"? Problem with the office space on Main has been the limited parking. Colonial style would bring needed ascetics that offer grace and will dignify our community. If an office complex was an option, it would have direct Rt 9 access, as well, the traffic patterns would be better for the local residents street, with most traffic gone by 5 or 6 PM. An Olive Garden will have a greater negative impact on the stability of a neighborhood ...imo |
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Post by Libyan Sibyl on Oct 25, 2007 16:23:56 GMT -5
I have to agree with both Cheryl and Fiber. Cheryll said that the Board should just vote No, "based on the fact that the application is completely non-conforming under zoning and the Borough Master Plan." I agree.
But if something is going to be done on borough property, which borders commerical zoning of Township property, what should be done, and do we want to be part of the talks when that inevitably happens.
It appears that it is a done-deal that something is going to happen on that property. The council hasbeen in negotiations with the township, which is how the Olive Garden went from being in the township to being in the borough.
And if something is going to be done, what should it be? Here is where I agree with Fiber. I can't agree with a restaurant. We have read that a bank will go on that property (what another bank!!!). What are other uses that these residents may approve of?
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Post by fiberisgoodforyou on Oct 25, 2007 16:50:22 GMT -5
The council has been in negotiations with the township, which is how the Olive Garden went from being in the township to being in the borough. Your comments above made me start thinking about all the RCA housing we have Negotiated to receive from the Township! How about we ask the Township to think about the value of office vs Restaurant, and work with US to plan for a better ratable for both municipalities, and work out a way for the space to accommodate a two building office office complex on each side of the property. If an amicable development plan can be agreed upon, every one wins. Again, if the Boro can take on the RCA from the Township, its about time both municipalities can implement a joint project for all to win, that we all deserve. |
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Post by cheryl on Oct 25, 2007 16:54:22 GMT -5
The Borough already has excess and perpetually vacant office space on West Main Street, with more under construction and approvals in place for even more. What is your reasoning behind calling for yet another office building, beyond the fact that offices are considered a "clean" rateable? (And why "Colonial Style"?) And do you believe that zoning, the Borough master plan and the stability of a neighborhood should be tossed aside in a "rateable chase"? Problem with the office space on Main has been the limited parking. There is a modern, freestanding office building in the block between the Baptist Church and Borough Hall (sorry, i don't have the address handy) that has its own on-site parking, which has never been fully rented in the nearly 15 years I've lived in town. (edited to provide address of that building: 71 West Main) That is purely a matter of opinion. One architectural style is not necessarily of more aesthetic value or worth than another. And while Freehold Borough does have a history that extends into the Colonial period, it is not a colonial town, architecturally. It would have access to Rt 9 via Manalapan Avenue and Park Avenue. The part of the property that is in the Borough does not front on Rt 9. And use as an office in no way guarantees activity from 9-5 only. No doubt. And just why is any negative impact acceptable? Are the homeowners in the neighborhood not entitled to the expectation that the town's zoning means what it says, unless there is a darned good reason for a variance? |
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Post by cheryl on Oct 25, 2007 17:02:42 GMT -5
The council hasbeen in negotiations with the township, which is how the Olive Garden went from being in the township to being in the borough. Can you provide a cite for this? Per the 8/22 News-Transcript article, the restaurant had to move from the township to the borough part of the property because a liquor license must be used in a building located within the borders of the issuing municipality. The original proposal (Ruby Tuesday) located the restaurant in Freehold Twp and the parking in the Borough because they held a liquor license issued by the Twp. |
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Post by stffgpr2003 on Oct 26, 2007 10:36:21 GMT -5
The owner has the right to sell to the highest bidder. The town has the right to approve or deny the unconformed use. It's in the Zoning Board's hands.
Popular opinion seems to be running in favor of keeping Jersey Freeze vs. Olive Garden. Let's face it, legends die hard!
Unfortunately, this is not one of the choices being offered to us, at the moment. However, if the Olive Garden is denied permission to build, it will be interesting to see if we can help determine the outcome at that location.
I'd like to see Mr. Blackmore handsomely rewarded for his many years of hard work and the town also come out a winner.
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